Strumming for JTR, Rhyme and Reason, WWYS..whatever....

[Jay]

first, i'm new here, so hi everyone. i've been playing acoutsic guitar for...i guess about 3 months. 3 frustrating months but it's also fun.

anyway, i was wondering something. when you play songs like JTR or rhyme and reason or fool to think, is it better to hit all the strings when your hand is going down, or to hit them down, up, down, up...?

i learned the instrumental intro to OSW (my crowning achievement so far...haha) and i play that one down-up down-up because i am trying to get that rhythm to be second nature. but what about faster songs like DIDO or WWYS? do i still want to do the down up thing? because it makes it hard to even play satellite because my hand gets all tangled up in the strings.

and finally, i cannot for the life of my get the rhythm to JTR right. i have the fingering ok, but the strumming for it...i just can't get it. any tips?

wow so i'm definitely a newbie....anyway, thanks for any help you got.

oh and 3 days to MSG...

[Chumpnet]

I would say play "down-up down-up" for all the songs (that are non-fingerpicked). The trick is knowing how many down-ups per beat (and how long a beat is).

It turns out that for Satellite verses, all the notes are played during the down parts.

For the rhythm to JTR take a look at this:
http://www.dmbtabs.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=362

The 1's and 3's are played downwards while the 2's and 4's are upward (but JTR also has pull-offs where you wouldn't strum) and this should give you an idea how it's done. JTR would be one heck of a challenging song for a beginner so hang in there.

[Jay]

wow that was a fast reply. i'm trying to do the most challenging stuff i can, to get better faster. it's frustrating, but so is the fact that i didn't start playing years ago.

satellite is all downs? isn't the strumming kinda fast then? how do you go about deciding how to strum, aside from watching a video? is there a rule of thumb for that sort of thing?

what about fool to think? that's all downs right?

sorry...so many questions.

[Jay]

thanks for the jtr help by the way.

[Chumpnet]

About the fast reply. I have a program that scans forum pages for words like "JTR", "DMB tabs", and "free pr0n" which alerts me. Just kidding, the speed of it is purely coincidental.

No song is categorized as all ups, all downs, or both. It's really only one type which is down up down up and it is the timing of the strum that decides the direction.

Satellite is downs only in the verses and transition. But the "winter's cold" and "rest high above" parts involve alternating strums. The verse is all downs but that's because Dave decided to leave the ups blank (not hit any notes). He theoretically could have decided to stick extra notes in between and those new notes would be ups. I would say that the strumming speed of Satellite is about average for Dave songs or a bit on the faster side.

Figuring out the speed of strumming usually comes naturally but here are some things to think about. Listen for the closest that 2 adjacent notes are being played. That is, the smallest amount of time between 2 notes. That would be the speed between a downstrum to upstrum and also up to down. I guess it's the smallest "granularity" of notes that decides the speed. However, this is ignoring hammer-ons and pull-offs. When you throw in hammer-ons and pull-offs, there is the possibility of sticking extra notes in between and making the granularity even smaller. I think this happens in Bartender.

Once you found the speed, you want to keep it steady through the whole verse/song. Just keep the hand moving. This general tip should apply to pretty much all of Dave's songs.

I shamefully do not remember "Fool to think" enough to tell you and I haven't learned that one (I don't listen to Everyday album much). But what I just mentioned should apply to that song too.

Hope this makes sense.

[mboz12]

dave uses a lot of just down strokes for songs ud be suprised

[mboz12]

and im freaking pumped for msg

[Jay]

thanks for all the help...

so basically i just find the fastest part of the song and that is the space between down-up?

i'm assuming wwys and rhyme and reason and recently are all downs? what about loving wings? sorry...kinda new here...

[ticohans]

Jay, I don't think it really matters that you get it EXACTLY down up down down up up up down up whatever. Find something that's comfortable for you, something that makes the song easiest to play, and go with that. That's my advice. The more you strum, the more intuitive the whole up/down thing will become.

[Chumpnet]

dave uses a lot of just down strokes for songs ud be suprised

This is true. In fact, when I hear a long sequence of notes in a song that are all fairly evenly spaced/timed, that is a clue to me that it is all down strokes. But it's rare that the entire song is all down strokes.

[Chumpnet]

Jay, I don't think it really matters that you get it EXACTLY down up down down up up up down up whatever. Find something that's comfortable for you, something that makes the song easiest to play, and go with that. That's my advice. The more you strum, the more intuitive the whole up/down thing will become.

It's important keep a critical eye to any advice that you get from a forum. So yeah, the important thing is to be happy with your own results.

But at the same time, one of the main goals of this page (and the reason I visit) is for the tabs to be accurate and you don't want to completely forget that.

Dave's strumming is efficient. IMO, the easiest way to play is the way Dave plays it so why not just start by emulating him. But that's just me.

[Xoosh]

Yep.

[Chumpnet]

thanks for all the help...

so basically i just find the fastest part of the song and that is the space between down-up?

i'm assuming wwys and rhyme and reason and recently are all downs? what about loving wings? sorry...kinda new here...

Move your hand just fast enough to get all the notes at the right time. Satellite verse played with downs is about the right speed. Playing it with alternating down-ups will be about half that speed and would be too slow because when you go into the chorus, you find yourself having to move your hand twice as fast. And Dave doesn't tend to make radical changes like that. Many of the songs won't stray very far from that speed. You can use it as a reference point. Lover Lay down verse can be played all downs and although it sounds like a much slower song, it is not a lot slower for the strumming hand.

I would play the verses of wwys R&R and recently with downs.

[dbernard]

wait, i'm confused... are you saying that you guys only use downstrokes on satellite? that makes absolutely no sense to me at all. i can't imagine using downstrokes on any of his stuff, what's the deal?

[Xoosh]

Use common sense my dear man! Basicly do waht is comfortable. No one says you have to do it exactly like dave does.. fingering and all.. just do what works. AND if something isnt working... experiment and find something that does. Especially at this stage in the game where it's very easy to start and keep bad habbits.

/x